Robin Beck

>>> "Not sure if that makes sense, and if it does, that is an apt description."

Yes, that makes sense.

I agree with your distinction of the first two cultivations and the latter - I sense the distinction in non-movement and movement. I don't know if I can explain it well, but the first two are concerned with focusing the mind, bringing it to stillness - while the latter, the mind is allowed to be more pliant - stimulation may "move" the mind, but because there is no attachment to the movements, they come and go effortlessly. Not sure if that makes sense, and if it does, that is an apt description.

I really appreciate the Pali Suttas. The are so wonderful. Shame so many in the Nichiren traditions don't explore them.

There is a description of how the Buddha discovered the first Jhana in the Maha Saccaka Sutta in the Digha Nikaya. This is a Sutta that describes the Buddha's personal quest leading to his enlightenment and his experience of enlightenment. Some excellent descriptions of what to do and what not to do. Here is the section where he describes determining that the Jhanas are the way to enlightenment:

"I thought: 'I recall once, when my father the Sakyan was working, and I was sitting in the cool shade of a rose-apple tree, then — quite secluded from sensuality, secluded from unskillful mental qualities — I entered & remained in the first jhana: rapture & pleasure born from seclusion, accompanied by directed thought & evaluation. Could that be the path to Awakening?' Then following on that memory came the realization: 'That is the path to Awakening.' I thought: 'So why am I afraid of that pleasure that has nothing to do with sensuality, nothing to do with unskillful mental qualities?' I thought: 'I am no longer afraid of that pleasure that has nothing to do with sensuality, nothing to do with unskillful mental qualities, but that pleasure is not easy to achieve with a body so extremely emaciated. Suppose I were to take some solid food: some rice & porridge.' So I took some solid food: some rice & porridge. Now five monks had been attending on me, thinking, 'If Gotama, our contemplative, achieves some higher state, he will tell us.' But when they saw me taking some solid food — some rice & porridge — they were disgusted and left me, thinking, 'Gotama the contemplative is living luxuriously. He has abandoned his exertion and is backsliding into abundance.'

"So when I had taken solid food and regained strength, then — quite secluded from sensuality, secluded from unskillful mental qualities, I entered & remained in the first jhana: rapture & pleasure born from seclusion, accompanied by directed thought & evaluation. But the pleasant feeling that arose in this way did not invade my mind or remain. With the stilling of directed thoughts & evaluations, I entered & remained in the second jhana: rapture & pleasure born of concentration, unification of awareness free from directed thought & evaluation — internal assurance. But the pleasant feeling that arose in this way did not invade my mind or remain. With the fading of rapture I remained equanimous, mindful, & alert, and sensed pleasure with the body. I entered & remained in the third jhana, of which the noble ones declare, 'Equanimous & mindful, he has a pleasant abiding.' But the pleasant feeling that arose in this way did not invade my mind or remain. With the abandoning of pleasure & pain — as with the earlier disappearance of elation & distress — I entered & remained in the fourth jhana: purity of equanimity & mindfulness, neither pleasure nor pain. But the pleasant feeling that arose in this way did not invade my mind or remain."

A link to one of the publications of the Sutta online:
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/mn/mn.036.than.html

Hi R,
First, I'm thinking about starting a thread over on MarkP's forum, Nichiren Sangha, to discuss the practice of meditation from a first hand perspective - a forum where we can discuss our experiences, discuss issues or obstacles that we have come across, methods, etc. - I know there are discussion forums on this subject elsewhere on the net, but I am not sure if there is any with a Nichiren orientation. Hope you'll check it out. I'm thinking I'll do that later this afternoon. The reason is that today I sat down for the first time in a long while and did a more thorough morning gongyo/meditation than I have in a long while and I was a little surprised at how I had regressed. It was good, however in the sense that I was reminded of difficulties I had when I first started meditating seriously. Hope to set it up as a resource for others who may want to pursue these types of practices.

I'll follow with comments on the post in a few minutes.

Q

Each of the four cultivations has its own, well, attainment, for lack of a better term:

1. Blissful abiding in the here and now; Diṭṭha-dhamma-sukha-vihara / drishta-dharma-sukha-viharata 現法樂住 {xianfa lezhu / genpo rakuji}

2. Knowledge & vision of reality as it is; Yathabhuta~nana-dassana / yathabhuta-jnana-darshana 如實知見 {rushi zhijian / jojitsu chiken}

3. Mindfulness with complete discerning spacious alertness; Sati-sampajanna / smrti-samprajanya 正念慧 {zheng nianhul / sho nen'e}

4. The Destruction of Inflows & Outflows; Asava-khaya / Ashrava-kshaya 漏盡

Right now, my take on the Four Cultivations of concentration:

1. The Four Fine Material Absorptions; catur rupa-dhyana. This one is very clear.

2. This might be the 8th jhana aka the 4th samapatti. I do not know.

3. The Four Frameworks [foundations] of Mindfulness -- cattaro satipatthana. The Chinese is 四念処 {si nanchu / shi-nenjo}

4. The appears to some kind of vipassana. It is an observation of the rising and falling of the Five Clinging Aggregates {Five Components of Life} Form, Feeling, [Mental] Perception, {Mental} Conditioning, and [discriminative] Consciousness.

That is a good point about different 'strata.' I guess these are analogous to the strata in an archaeologist dig. I read some long, boring paper on this a few years ago. Something more accessible that clarfies a few things would help.

1. My understanding was that in the oldest strata, the Suttas referred to the 5th-8th jhanas as samapattis or 'attainments;' while the later suttas called them arupa jhanas -- formless or immaterial asbsorptions.

2. Also, my understanding in that the more recent got sloppier in the use of technical terms. Some words that originally had clearer, distinct meanings often became synonyms and were used interchangeably later on.

One set: Vinnana, citta, samjna, manas.

Another set: Vidya, panna {prajna}, nana {jnana].

Another: Samatha, samadhi, jhana {dhyana}, samapati, sati {smrti}, vipassana.

On your comment about the overlap - I have read comments that the Nikaya/Agama Sutta/Sutra are not wholly consistent, and have observed this myself, in the sense that sometimes this issue elaborated here, but explained cursively there, or a teaching is presented as a sort or stand alone practice in one circumstance, and an integrated practice elsewhere. The linguistic analysis seems to reveal a core of teachings and then layers of elaborations (the core they found being the proof of the historical Buddha - ie. it is so consistent that it must be the output of a single individual). In any event, regardless of how they came to this, the various teachings, elaborated by various explanations birthed the various schools.

At these points, Zhiyi is a welcome commentator when he states that all the teachings, elaborated in lists of one, two, 10, 20, are all relating to the single enlightenment. The various ways of explaining phenomena are the means to understand - the tail, trunk, leg, torso, ears, of the elephant.

This one explains 7 Jhanas. 4 Form, 3 Formless.
http://tipitaka.wikia.com/wiki/Potthapada_Sutta

I see the over lap; but it does not clarify the 2nd and 4th cultivations of concentration

The concentration of the four jhanas leads to Diṭṭha-dhamma-sukha-vihara / drishta-dharma-sukha-viharatav "a blissful abiding in the here and now." That is the first cultivation of concentration above.

The third is Four Frameworks of Mindfulness; Cattaro satipaṭṭhana / catur smrti-upasthana; and leads to Sati-sampajanna / smrti-samprajanya "mindfulness with complete and correct discerning awareness {alertness, attentiveness}.

I noticed the Four Right Exertions or cattari sammappadhana are covered as the "Four Restraints."

Also this, not quite on topic, but relevant in general:
http://tipitaka.wikia.com/wiki/Maha-satipatthana_Sutta

Have you seen this from the Digha Nikaya?

http://tipitaka.wikia.com/wiki/Samannaphala_Sutta

Its a wonderful Sutta with lots of good stuff, but particularly relevant to this present discussion, there is an exposition on the four jhanas.

Anguttara Nikaya / Numbered Discourses

Lists of Fours / AN 4.41 PTS: A ii 44

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an04/an04.041.than.html

That is the only translation I have seen. I could not find any useful commentaries. This is where E-Sangha might help. I ran it past another group and got no responses so far.

Hi R,
Do you have citations to the Nikayas where these states are discussed?
Thanks!
:)